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Home » The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints » Current Church Doctrine » Knowledge enough to sin (When do we know enough to be accountable to knowledge?)
Re: Knowledge enough to sin [message #528 is a reply to message #523] Thu, 21 June 2012 10:30 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Amonhi is currently offline  Amonhi
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Registered: June 2010
Location: Las Vegas, NV.
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In short? Yes. The church uses the fear of God to encourage those new in the faith to obey the commandments. It has been said it is better to do the right thing for the wrong reason, until we learn what the right reason for obedience is. This is the lower law.

Your are right, it is the lower law.

Each kingdom has laws and principles which are true only in that kingdom or sphere. If you want to reside in that kingdom, then you only have to live up to the truths and light by which that sphere is governed.

This is largely where the "Law of Universal Application" comes to play.

The "Law of Universal Application" says that all truth in a sphere of existence must be equally applied to all who reside in that sphere.

So, for example, in the telestial/lowest kingdom, I can lie to everyone. Applying that principle equally to everyone means that everyone can lie to me too. So, we say that liars go to the Telestial kingdom. So do adulterers, murderers, theifs, etc.

One of the truths of this kingdom is, "Everyone will lie, cheat and take advantage of you, so you need to lie, steal and cheat and take advantage of them to succeed and thrive." That is true in this sphere. And everyone who lives in this sphere of existence follows the same rules.

If we want to live with God, then we need to learn how to exist in Gods sphere. We cannot just go to His heaven and ruin it for Him, and make it hell for Him. In fact, everyone who lives in the Celestial Kingdom has learned how to exist with others in a just and equal way, with love being the way. Everyone in the Celestial Realm has learned to do what is right even at our own expense or when it does not favor us.

So essentially, we will live in the society that we create for others. If we stop lying, stealing, murdering, etc. then we can move on to a new sphere in which we are again with people like unto ourselves. We no longer belong to the sphere in which truth says that everyone is a liar and will take advantage of you, so you need to lie and take advantage of them.

Some people who get tired of being cheated will will make one of 2 decisions:
  1. I'm going to cheat others even more because that is the world I live in.
  2. I can't believe someone would do that to me! I will be even more sure to not hurt others the way this person hurt me.
Law are given to those in the lower kingdoms to keep them in check. They have a form, (semblance or appearance), of Godliness but deny the power, (LOVE), thereof. The form of Godliness that they exhibit is that they do not lie, murder and steal. But the power that sustains this form is the law and its attached punishment.

If a person were to be caught stealing then they would be punished by the law. The sting of the law is the punishment. Those under the law obey the law because they fear the punishment. That punishment can come form the Government, the church, or both, (or in some cases from God directly), depending on who's law they are breaking.

The higher law has no punishments or rules and gets its power from the power of God which is Love. It isn't really a law as much as it is the power which negates the need for laws. It creates the true form of God. Where people live together governing themselves without laws.

Sin can only happen when we are under the lower law. Christ was born into the lower law and came to show the people how to escape it. We want to escape it because all under the law are condemned by the law because all are sinners against the law. But when hte law is fulfilled in Love, then there is not law. Without law you cannot sin.

Here are a few of the hundreds of scriptures that teach this...

"1 Corinthians 15:56"
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

"Gal. 3:24-25"

24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

"Galatians 5:14"
14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.


"Galatians 5:18, 22-23"

18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.


"Romans 3:19"

19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.


"Romans 6:14-18"

14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?
17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

If you are placed under the law as a Child, then you are bound to do every jot and tittle of the law before it is fulfilled and removed. Christ was born under the law and did all things under the law, (Even though he didn't need the law himself. He fulfilled all aspects of the law "inorder to fulfill all righteousness". This also allowed him to show others the way out of the law.
"Galatians 5:3"

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

In the Millennium, parents will understand how to raise their children without the law and so without sin until salvation.

Back to Dragon's quote at the top...
The church teaches the lower law, which is known as the law of Moses and the Preparatory Gospel which was restored with the Aaronic Priesthood by John the Baptist.

As such, there are those in the church who use, teach and expect results from guilt and fear and punishment and so, they teach the "doctrines of Men" or those doctrines which are not Godly and centered in and motivated by LOVE, to manipulate people toward obedience using duty, obligation, fear, expectation, etc. to get others to live the appearance of righteous lives while yet being unrighteous in heart.

In this way the church gives us a tremendous amount of Thou shalt and thou shalt not commandments which detail almost every aspect of our lives from Sunday activities to the number of earrings that girls can have. The bishop and stake pres. are the judges that enforce the punishments as needed. But these are not eternal and eventually there will be no need for the preparatory church or the doctrines of men as described above with their lower methods which have a form of Godliness but deny the true power therefore.

[Updated on: Thu, 21 June 2012 10:54]

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