Elliaison.org - Forum
Elliaison.org forum is a free discussion group focused on the persuit of truth and spiritual knowledge from every source.

Home » The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints » LDS Deep Doctrine » Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn (Discussion and questions)
icon3.gif  Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #783] Mon, 30 July 2012 19:18 Go to next message
JulesGP
Messages: 357
Registered: May 2012
Location: Davis County, UT
Senior Member

First of all, if I'm way off base, then someone correct me and point me in the right direction.

It seems that the members of the LDS church have the understanding that the general membership of the church will make-up Zion. Without spelling out why, I cannot fathom how this could be possible. I also know people who believe it will be made up of those in the earth who are "good people", but not necessarily members of the church, or having any other qualifications besides being "good".

I've developed an understanding that Zion will be made up of those who are members of the Church of the Firstborn. There are SO many scriptures and SO MUCH background that is leading me to this conclusion, but I'm including a few things here to establish a foundation (leaving out "understood" definitions, such as the definition of a member of the Church of the Firstborn being one who has received their Calling and Election.) Then again, some of this may be second nature to some of you, and I'm just learning it - so I've included it.

If I'm right, and this has been spelled out elsewhere on the forum, then I apologize for the redundancy. Very Happy Also, my thoughts are a bit scattered and I haven't put this together in a clear format yet, so I apologize for that too. I want to gain some feedback and more understanding before I do that, so I'm hoping to get that here.

First of all, my understanding is that Zion in the last days - is likened unto the City of Enoch, and will be similar. Further, my understanding is that all of the inhabitants of the City of Enoch were members of the Church of the Firstborn - and that is essentially synonymous with the Church of Enoch.

Note all of Moses 7 but specifically:

Quote:
62 And arighteousness will I send down out of heaven; and truth will I send forth out of the earth, to bear btestimony of mine Only Begotten; his cresurrection from the dead; yea, and also the resurrection of all men; and righteousness and truth will I cause to sweep the earth as with a flood, to dgather out mine elect from the four quarters of the earth, unto a place which I shall prepare, an Holy City, that my people may gird up their loins, and be looking forth for the time of my coming; for there shall be my tabernacle, and it shall be called eZion, a New fJerusalem.

63 And the Lord said unto Enoch: Then shalt thou and all thy acity meet them there, and we will breceive them into our bosom, and they shall see us; and we will fall upon their necks, and they shall fall upon our necks, and we will kiss each other;

64 And there shall be mine abode, and it shall be Zion, which shall come forth out of all the creations which I have made; and for the space of a athousand years the bearth shall crest.

65 And it came to pass that Enoch saw the aday of the bcoming of the Son of Man, in the last days, to dwell on the earth in righteousness for the space of a thousand years;

66 But before that day he saw great tribulations among the wicked; and he also saw the sea, that it was troubled, and men's hearts afailing them, looking forth with fear for the bjudgments of the Almighty God, which should come upon the wicked.

67 And the Lord showed Enoch all things, even unto the end of the world; and he saw the day of the righteous, the hour of their redemption, and received a fulness of ajoy;

68 And all the days of aZion, in the days of Enoch, were three hundred and sixty-five years.

69 And Enoch and all his people awalked with God, and he dwelt in the midst of Zion; and it came to pass that Zion was not, for God received it up into his own bosom; and from thence went forth the saying, Zion is Fled.


In order for God to be able to walk and talk with the people of the city of Enoch, it seems that they would HAVE to have been sealed up unto eternal life and exaltation, and have received the Second Comforter. They would HAVE to be more than just "good people" in order to walk and talk with God that way. Zion is supposed to be similar - not just good people, but those who live the way Enoch and his people did here on this earth which qualified them for the blessings they received, and for the opportunity to be translated and taken up into Heaven.

Quote:
JST- Genesis 9

1 And the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant, which I made unto thy father Enoch; that, when men should keep all my commandments, Zion should again come on the earth, the city of Enoch which I have caught up unto myself.

22 And this is mine everlasting covenant, that when thy posterity shall embrace the truth, and look upward, then shall Zion look downward, and all the heavens shall shake with gladness, and the earth shall tremble with joy;

23 And the general assembly of the church of the first-born shall come down out of heaven, and possess the earth, and shall have place until the end come. And this is mine everlasting covenant, which I made with thy father Enoch.


Quote:
D&C 76

54 They are they who are the achurch of the bFirstborn.

55 They are they into whose hands the Father has given aall things--

56 They are they who are apriests and bkings, who have received of his fulness, and of his glory;

57 And are apriests of the Most High, after the order of Melchizedek, which was after the order of bEnoch, which was after the corder of the Only Begotten Son.

58 Wherefore, as it is written, they are agods, even the bsons of cGod--

59 Wherefore, aall things are theirs, whether life or death, or things present, or things to come, all are theirs and they are Christ's, and Christ is God's.

60 And they shall aovercome all things.

61 Wherefore, let no man aglory in man, but rather let him bglory in God, who shall csubdue all enemies under his feet.

62 These shall adwell in the bpresence of God and his Christ forever and ever.

63 These are they whom he shall bring with him, when he shall acome in the bclouds of heaven to creign on the earth over his people.

64 These are they who shall have part in the afirst resurrection.

65 These are they who shall come forth in the resurrection of the ajust.

66 These are they who are come unto aMount bZion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly place, the holiest of all.

67 These are they who have come to an innumerable company of aangels, to the general assembly and church of bEnoch, and of the cFirstborn.


Quote:
Micah 4
2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the amountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will bwalk in his paths: for the claw shall go forth of dZion, and the word of the Lord from eJerusalem.


And

Quote:
2Nephi 12

2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, awhen the bmountain of the Lord's chouse shall be established in the top of the dmountains, and shall be exalted above the hills, and all nations shall flow unto it.

3 And many apeople shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the bmountain of the Lord, to the chouse of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will dwalk in his paths; for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.


Quote:
D&C 45

66 And it shall be called the aNew Jerusalem, a bland of cpeace, a city of drefuge, a place of esafety for the saints of the Most High God;

67 And the aglory of the Lord shall be there, and the bterror of the Lord also shall be there, insomuch that the wicked will not come unto it, and it shall be called Zion.


If the glory of the Lord is there and they are considered the saints of the Most High God, then it seems logical to me that the inhabitants would have to have been sealed with the promise.

I understand that the 144k are called to gather the righteous to the Church of the Firstborn, helping them to obtain their C&E:

Quote:
D&C 77:11
"Q. What are we to understand by sealing the one hundred and forty-four thousand, out of all the tribes of Israel--twelve thousand out of every tribe?
A. We are to understand that those who are sealed are high priests, ordained unto the holy order of God, to administer the everlasting gospel; for they are they who are ordained out of every nation, kindred, tongue, and people, by the angels to whom is given power over the nations of the earth, to bring as many as will come to the church of the Firstborn."


So the 144k are gathering the future inhabitants of Zion....... am I correct??



~Jules
Re: Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #785 is a reply to message #783] Mon, 30 July 2012 21:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon is currently offline  Dragon
Messages: 499
Registered: June 2010
Location: Earth
Senior Member
Here's the thing about the 144,000. There are three groups identified as such, and they may not be the same people. First, in Rev 7, the 144,000 bring a countless multitude into the Church of the Firstborn. Then, later, after WW4, a group of 144,000 from the Church of the Firstborn go to Jackson County and build Zion. They prepare it not only for themselves, but also for the lost ten tribes who will be arriving at a currently unspecified time. The city of Enoch will also arrive at some point and the two cities will function together. At some point later, another group, also called the 144,000 will travel from Zion to Jerusalem after the two prophets are slain. This last group will settle Jerusalem, build the Temple, and support the reign of the Prince of Peace, King David.

All three of these groups, whether they be one or three, are members of the Church of the Firstborn. What's more, they are experienced members, with the possibility of a few new converts to the Church of the Firstborn.

Zion will be defended only by the presence of the Lord shining the light of His Spirit. In order to maintain it, the entire city is as holy as the temple. No one unworthy can even visit without becoming extremely uncomfortable.


- Dragon
Re: Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #889 is a reply to message #783] Fri, 10 August 2012 23:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zephyr is currently offline  zephyr
Messages: 129
Registered: May 2012
Senior Member
Jules, I think you are right.

I found a very interesting Church News article that seems to support that position. I have attached it as a file:

[Updated on: Fri, 10 August 2012 23:21]

Report message to a moderator

Re: Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #890 is a reply to message #889] Sat, 11 August 2012 00:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JulesGP
Messages: 357
Registered: May 2012
Location: Davis County, UT
Senior Member

I like it Zephyr! Thank you for posting this! I just ordered the Book of Enoch - the printed version of this one here:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/

I want to gain some more insight on Enoch and his city and the people, etc. But the concept just feels good to me.


~Jules
Re: Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #915 is a reply to message #890] Thu, 16 August 2012 00:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JulesGP
Messages: 357
Registered: May 2012
Location: Davis County, UT
Senior Member

Just found some more info on this... A chapter from "Approaching Zion" by Hugh Nibley:

http://maxwellinstitute.byu.edu/publications/books/?bookid=75&chapid=928


~Jules
Re: Zion - made up of members of the Church of the Firstborn [message #1612 is a reply to message #783] Sat, 15 December 2012 22:00 Go to previous message
Kingdom of ZION is currently offline  Kingdom of ZION
Messages: 46
Registered: November 2012
Location: Colorado
Member
Which come first? Zion or the Church of the Firstborn? Well, to be a member in the Church of the Firstborn, one must be born in the Morning of the First Resurrection (actually a raising or rebirth, NOT a Resurrection!). Zion is built long before the Second Coming. So, if this is the only world were born into then, there is NO members of the church of the Firstborn to be gathered and to build Zion.

IF there are members down here as I openly declare, because of the different levels some Beings are at in the Estates of Probation, then we have Beings to gather and the ability to possibly build Zion with. This one fact evades 97% of the Latter-Day Saints. Until they open their hearts and their preconceived notions that it is what they have decided it is... very few will ever be gathered, when that time comes. It is prophesied that the Gentiles (the LDS) will not repent but a very few will be numbered among Yesrael in the end.

Shalom


Coming of Eliyah is yet future, the Restoration of Yesrael and the Kingdom or Gospel and the other 2/3's of the Book of Mormon will follow. If Eliyah does not come, then with the coming of the Messiah, the earth shall be cursed and utterly wasted!
Previous Topic: Repentance before vs. after Calling and Election
Next Topic: ?? Who is "The One" ??
Goto Forum:
  


Current Time: Thu Apr 25 02:10:38 MDT 2024